So where is the UK's Brexit masterplan?

[Jimgward]

This is an arranged press picture.... not manipulated by any side. I’d say, at best, the EU team realised the implications of having piles of paper in front of them against none on the UK side.... although I actually think the UK team decided to be photographed the way it was....

So, thinking this is some evil manipulation is just plain silly.

I do agree, however, with Geoffrey (taking tablets and sitting down) that this isn’t a time for bickering, leaks and so on. Any leadership contest will be because MAY has filled her cabinet with ministers stronger than herself, who have ambitions of leadership. That’s her problem.

Brexit for us all relies upon proper and worthwhile negotiations. I relayed last week on another thread, that Spain are very worried over brexit. They want a separate deal with the UK, if necessary, to prevent loss of tourism, property and other factors. They don’t know if it will be possible outside the EU, but brexit is worrying most member states as much as it is the UK.

A successful brexit for everyone, will be the UK freely trading and allowing semi-freedom movement of EU nationals, at the UK’s behest.... allowing vital jobs to be filled. It will also prevent loss of jobs to other European countries, which sadly has already started. It is absolutely vital to have that trade agreement. Even a nominal tax on financial transactions could scupper vast swathes of industry.

[Jimgward]

I actually suspect the EU negotiating team do not have a clue and need the paperwork to remind them.... Having that much paper in front of you is showmanship, probably picked up from an office on the way to the photo op.....as Pete so eloquently puts, the main effort of the EU negotiating stance is to make this as painful aand difficult for the UK as possible, make an example of those "Little Englanders" who dare to defy the right of the EU...they care little for any deal that is benificial to both sides, they care only for their precious Federal State.

Your quote “Little Englanders” is one strong reason why many in Scotland seek independence.... this link of England being the UK and the UK being England is used by many in other parts of the world, but even more by people in England.

[Rita Sherry]

"Little Englanders", has never been more appropriate given that it's only England at the Negotiating table.

Incorrect RW - the people concerned are the representatives of the duly elected Government of the UNITED KINGDOM.

Rita

[geoffreys]

"Little Englanders", has never been more appropriate given that it's only England at the Negotiating table.

Incorrect RW - the people concerned are the representatives of the duly elected Government of the UNITED KINGDOM.

Rita

Which includes Scotland!
Geoff.

[ApusApus]

This is an arranged press picture.... not manipulated by any side. I’d say, at best, the EU team realised the implications of having piles of paper in front of them against none on the UK side.... although I actually think the UK team decided to be photographed the way it was....

So, thinking this is some evil manipulation is just plain silly.

I do agree, however, with Geoffrey (taking tablets and sitting down) that this isn’t a time for bickering, leaks and so on. Any leadership contest will be because MAY has filled her cabinet with ministers stronger than herself, who have ambitions of leadership. That’s her problem.

Brexit for us all relies upon proper and worthwhile negotiations. I relayed last week on another thread, that Spain are very worried over brexit. They want a separate deal with the UK, if necessary, to prevent loss of tourism, property and other factors. They don’t know if it will be possible outside the EU, but brexit is worrying most member states as much as it is the UK.

A successful brexit for everyone, will be the UK freely trading and allowing semi-freedom movement of EU nationals, at the UK’s behest.... allowing vital jobs to be filled. It will also prevent loss of jobs to other European countries, which sadly has already started. It is absolutely vital to have that trade agreement. Even a nominal tax on financial transactions could scupper vast swathes of industry.

I don't disagree with your comments but the problem is that a successful UK exit could mean the end of the EU model which is something Germany et al will protect at all cost ........... bit of a catch 22 really!


Shane

[ApusApus]

"Little Englanders", has never been more appropriate given that it's only England at the Negotiating table.

Incorrect RW - the people concerned are the representatives of the duly elected Government of the UNITED KINGDOM.

Rita

Quite!


Shane

[Pete G]

So, thinking this is some evil manipulation is just plain silly.

Just to be clear I wasn't saying the picture itself was manipulated. I was saying that the EU position of undermining the UK position by using the 'Remain at any cost' contingent to destabilise the UK position internally rather than having to do its own dirty work.

Whether the 'paperwork' was a deliberately designed ploy or a serendipitous occurrence is not really material to my point.

Just to notice the ravenous enthusiasm the remainers, and the remainer press, immediately jumped on the most disparaging interpretation possible of the image without having to bother with any tedious details like...... well.... the facts, for example

Just as one might expect from a fifth column really, Barnier's strategy has clearly worked better than he could possibly have hoped for

[Jimgym]

Incorrect, in your opinion. My Government, the government I elected, the government duly elected to represent the people of Scotland has no voice in these negotiations. We are not like England, the parliament in England is sovereign, in Scotland the people are sovereign. We voted to remain yet we have no voice, make no mistake, we will not be dragged out of the EU against the sovereign will of the people. If that's all you have, do not waste your time and mine, with a reply.

Wrong, once again.

[Jimgym]

"Little Englanders", has never been more appropriate given that it's only England at the Negotiating table.

Incorrect RW - the people concerned are the representatives of the duly elected Government of the UNITED KINGDOM.

Rita

Correct Rita, irrespective of opinions or anything else, it is a fact. One which apparently some refuse to see.

[Jimgym]

Irrespective of opinions, including yours.

It's not an opinion, it's a fact, big difference.
fact
noun
a thing that is indisputably the case.
o·pin·ion
noun
a view or judgment formed about something, not necessarily based on fact or knowledge.

[Jimgym]

I don't need an English lesson from you, as I said, if that's all you have, save it.

Apparently you do as you seem to be struggling to differentiate between fact and opinion.

[Jimgym]

Thanks for the advice, a gentle reminder that this is a discussion board. Opinions and facts are shared here. Feel free to block me, that's my piece of advice to you.

[Jimgym]

You're welcome for the advice, I try to help where I can.

As do I, especially where there is an obvious need. You are most welcome.

[Firefly]

Personally I think England would be far better off without Scotland or Wales. With a Scottish Parliament and a Welsh Assembly, they are both more than capable of ruling themselves without us. By that I mean no input in any form from England at all, ever. So everyone would be happy, yes.

Jackie

[ApusApus]

Personally I think England would be far better off without Scotland or Wales. With a Scottish Parliament and a Welsh Assembly, they are both more than capable of ruling themselves without us. By that I mean no input in any form from England at all, ever. So everyone would be happy, yes.

Jackie

Would be interesting to see how Scotland would fair outside the EU & the UK ............ recipe for disaster methinks!


Shane

[outasite]

Incorrect, in your opinion. My Government, the government I elected, the government duly elected to represent the people of Scotland has no voice in these negotiations. We are not like England, the parliament in England is sovereign, in Scotland the people are sovereign. We voted to remain yet we have no voice, make no mistake, we will not be dragged out of the EU against the sovereign will of the people. If that's all you have, do not waste your time and mine, with a reply.

I am sure your beloved first minister and Mr corbyn will do all in their power to scupper any agreement even if it us in the best interests of the United Kingdom.

[ApusApus]

Would be interesting to see how Scotland would fair outside the EU & the UK ............ recipe for disaster methinks!


Shane

You thinks, really.
[/quote]


No, I know for sure ............... like most normal Scots do as well!


Shane