Senior Brexiteer Dan Hannan admits leaving EU is not quite going to plan

[Jimgward]

In

[merchant_banker]

In

In the Evening Standard !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Who left government in disgrace after all his prophecies were unfounded and is now the editor of the Evening Standard.

[Varky]

Not going to plan. This always assumes that there has ever been a plan. This government has contrived to make such a hash of things, despite the majority of people voting for it. As it stands the it is obvious that the lack of intelligence within the government they are about to make a dog's breakfast of everything thus opening the door for the continued boring rants and raves from HIC et al who are unable to differentiate from what should have been simply following the wish of the majority into being able to use the incompetence of the government as evidence of Brexit being a complete catastrophe.
A horse being constructed by this government would turn out to be a rhinoceros.

[Jimgward]

Not going to plan. This always assumes that there has ever been a plan. This government has contrived to make such a hash of things, despite the majority of people voting for it. As it stands the it is obvious that the lack of intelligence within the government they are about to make a dog's breakfast of everything thus opening the door for the continued boring rants and raves from HIC et al who are unable to differentiate from what should have been simply following the wish of the majority into being able to use the incompetence of the government as evidence of Brexit being a complete catastrophe.
A horse being constructed by this government would turn out to be a rhinoceros.

OK, Varky, O wise one.....

Hoe would you propose a solution? On one hand, we have the fervent Brexiteers in the Tory party, insisting that everything is hard - no customs union, no trade agreements. Then we have the softer approach, despised by Brexit supporters.

Then we have the Irish situation, where a hard brexit will force a hard border and will probably lead to an Irish reunification earlier than is wise.... And the DUP going tonto at any attempt for differential deals....
Or the Irish situation, where a soft brexit, will cause carnage in the Government.

There is no solution on the table, as no solution will appease everyone and will lead to unbelievable problems.

Add to all this, the pound is still weak, the economy is not growing. Wages have stagnated (for most people) The EU is overtaking the UK by the day. - Ah.... but we have record employment!

The reality is, the country is not well run. Brexit is terribly run. Even HMRC are saying there is no half-baked solutions that will work.

[Jimgward]

As you say, we have enough debts that the Tories promised would be eradicated by 2020. Well, they’ve increased. I think Osborne left a note saying “we started with nothing and finished with less”

The EU has much better growth than the UK and as we have been told in the uk, austerity is still very much alive and will be for at least another 3 years. Likely another 7.

Then again, austerity is a measure to constrain most of society so the top echolons don’t suffer. That’s why the rich get richer ...

[Firefly]

If Cameron had done his job properly, a plan would have already been in place, he was so sure that it would be a NO vote, that he didn't even consider that he might just be wrong, how arrogant is that !

Jackie

[Dominic]

If Cameron had done his job properly, a plan would have already been in place, he was so sure that it would be a NO vote, that he didn't even consider that he might just be wrong, how arrogant is that !

Jackie

Oh come off it. If he had turned around to the electorate and said "We will have a referendum but first we need to decide what we are going to be voting for and that will take years" then the likes of UKIP et al would have called him everything under the sun, and the Brexit supporters would have split the tory vote in the next election

As it happens, he should have done that before we had the vote, because then people would have seen what they were voting for, but the brexiters wouldn't let him.

[Firefly]

Are you really saying that people shouldn't know what they are voting for ?

We voted for our own reasons, maybe if the politicians had been more transparent, things may have turned out differently, who knows. I still say Cameron was a coward, he lied to us then turned tail a ran because it all went pair shaped for him.

[Dominic]

No I'm saying they should know.

[Firefly]

Dominic

It won't take years to plan out I hope, as I want to be alive to see us leave the EU. Cameron should at least have put a skeleton plan in place, and informed us of it, instead of being so sure it would be a yes vote, and doing damn all preparation in case of a no vote.

[Firefly]

LLoyd

You live in Cyprus, you do not reside in the UK, you have no concept of living here so how can you judge. As I recall, you could have voted, but decided not to bother, so why moan about Brexit, when you, and all the others who couldn't be bothered to vote, might have made a difference if you had.

I did engage my brain, it may well be older than yours, but not addled ! Rudeness is not necessary to win an argument, it never will be.

TD

Aims and targets would have been a good start.

Jackie

[merchant_banker]

LLoyd

You live in Cyprus, you do not reside in the UK, you have no concept of living here so how can you judge. As I recall, you could have voted, but decided not to bother, so why moan about Brexit, when you, and all the others who couldn't be bothered to vote, might have made a difference if you had.



Jackie

Well said

[Jimgward]

Well it’s brexit at any cost. Today it was announced that arch bigot of the DUP Willie McCrea is to be made a lord. The man who proposed the raf straddling Irish towns in the troubles. A supporter of terrorism and a sectarian nutter.

Well Theresa, you will reap what you sow. The problem of the Irish border won’t be solved by baubles for votes. You tried fortunes in cash. The house of cards will topple

[Jimgward]

Jim....I did not know this person and had to look him up. I have to agree, Brexit or not this person has no place in our Political System. Any person who is a sympathiser, as they give support and cover for unlawful acts of Terror, or an active Terrorist, has any place in our HOL's or any part of our Government.

I didn’t know him either, other than the vague recollection of someone proposing the attacks on the RoI, but totally agree we shouldn’t be giving titles to people we wouldn’t invited into our own house.

[Firefly]

I live in one of the largest fruit producing counties in England, we have a huge number of foreign fruit pickers, mainly I think Polish. What a lot of rubbish some papers print.

As I have said before, the fruit farmers here shunned local women pickers in favour of foreign pickers. Local women with small children were robbed of the little income they could make at fruit picking time. Many were angry that they had been overlooked, some after years of loyal work. If those same farmers ever find themselves at a later date without pickers, blame the farmers, not Mrs May !

Jackie

[Firefly]

TD

I didn't think that you were, I just wanted to point out to LLoyd that the article was untrue.

Jackie

[Firefly]

Lloyd

The article you copied says that Farmers are reporting "an acute shortage of labour" I'm saying that's a complete lie ! No shortage here.

You didn't address my point that IF it ever happens, it will be their own fault. Greed for money often has a habit of biting back.


Jackie

[living the dream]

It may have escaped some people that between the EU Member states there are thousands of hospitals and I would "suggest" that the drop over the last year may also have something to do with better pay policies being introduced in member states healthcare systems to try and attract back some of the lost and valued nursing staff historically working in the UK. I would also "suggest" that the amount of nurses becoming qualified annually has could have also potentially dropped - it is easy to take figures and utilise them to try and win a debate however the NHS was in trouble with staff shortages before the Brexit vote.

[Firefly]

Yes the NHS has problems, why ? lack of money. Mr Hunt should be able to work that one out, even if he is a politician.

Nurses have always been poorly paid for the job they do, they have our lives in their hands, but are paid a pittance. Maybe the reason people choose a different career. They are expected to work all hours without paid overtime, try telling a woman in labour to stop pushing because it's the end of your shift, or walk out in the middle of an operation, because you've worked your allotted hours for the day. They arrange for translators to assist non English speaking patients, only to find that the patient fails to turn up for their appointment. Nurses should do just that nurse, but too much admin and paper work is now expected of them. It's no wonder the nurses we already have are looking for other employment. It's a career where the ONLY reward is seeing your patients respond to TLC.

Let's put the blame where it belongs, with our own government.

Jackie

[Jimgward]

Even if the NHS funds increased 5% year on year, it would only address the wage rises needed, since austerity has not increased nurses and others wages in 10 years.

Austerity, to reduce a deficit and a national debt that was to paid off by 2022, yet that has increased, all labour’s fault

In 2008, the national debt was £.5trillion and is now £1.8trillion

George Osborne promised to eliminate the deficit by 2015.