Viewpoint: UK will Exit EU with no deal

[kingfisher]

Devil- I normally only post articles in full if they are from subscription access journals.
[Sorry if it has put a couple of groats on your electricity bill!]

[Firefly]

Personally I hate links, if you have something to say then say it, posting a link means to me that you can't be bothered to post the article.

Jackie

[outasite]

You really do take the biscuit don't you? Every single pee taking post you and your best mate Happy in Cyprus have written since the majority of voters decided to leave your beloved EU , have contained...ifs, buts, possibilities, and on and on. Speculation. Just propoganda. In a word, rubbish. I've read all your funny little Brexit jokes, not a one of which is funnier than the sight of Herr Druncker stumbling around rat-a***d, and feel dismay that the EU negotiators are refusing to accept anything we offer. Do you seriously, under all your vitriolic pee take think that the businesses in the EU and this includes Cyprus's agriculture exports, will just roll over and accept the huge loss of profit and trade they have with the UK? There are something like 206 sovereign nations in the world, which is 206 nations the UK can do deals with under those WTO rules you are poo pooing, something we are not allowed to do at present. That figure includes the member nations of your beloved EU assuming your beloved EU doesn't prevent those nation's businesses from trading with the UK , (as if the EU would do that, tsk tsk, the EU may be a bully but it is not silly....is it?). And if your beloved EU doesn't allow trade with the UK, well I can't think of a single thing that I won't be able to get from somewhere in the world except possibly halloumi.

Not sure I understand this. Anyone able to translate into plain English

In as few words as possible.....The likes of you - who didn't bother to vote - and Ohsuzie who makes a habit of derogatory remarks to all and sundry, except you, of course, are p***ing me off with your comments.

[Jim B]

Outasite
There is nothing stopping us trading with the 206 companies now and getting Halloumi Cheese as well. You may not like HIC's and OS' s take on things but it's their opinions, just like yours. The Pound has dropped against the Euro (undeniable) and there are directives in place to control EU Immigration into the UK but the government decided not to implement them (undeniable).
Junker was put forward as president of the EU Commission by the Council of Ministers and voted for by MEPs who were in turn voted for by Joe Public (undeniable) He may have a drink problem, I don't know but he does not make policy in the EU, the government's of the 27 members do.
The EU is not negotiating for anything, it is the UK who is trying to gain favourable terms when it leaves. The UK wants the EU to compromise on the four foundations of The European Union ; its a bit like asking the USA to rewrite its Constitution to suit the UK.
The UK is not negotiating with Cyprus or Spain or Portugal it is negotiating with the EU of which there are 27 members and whether Cyprus takes a hit will depend on a collective vote of the 27 and not on each countries individual decision. I'm not certain if each country has a veto on any agreement made but if so it will only take one to stop any negotiated settlement.
I personally always thought Democracy was dynamic and decisions were not cast in stone and that is why people are changing their minds in favour of remaining; you may disagree but that's what democracy is all about.

Jim

[outasite]

Fair comment Jim. I really do not mind people's opinions, that is quite correctly their right in our Democracy.
My main point was the constant - constant - derogatory remarks made by those two about those who voted to leave the EU. I consider myself quite intelligent, not Mensa but not an imbecile, and I voted leave. Not because of immigration, I couldn't care less so long as all - all - arrivals could pay their way and not be a drain on the system, not because I feel that our jobs are being taken by Johnny Foreigner, and certainly not because Boris promised £350 million a week to the NHS. I voted leave because I was lied to by the politicians in the early 70s, when I voted to join a Customs Union of free trade between 6 nations of Europe. But I, along with 17.4 million others, am classed by those two to be a fool at best and at worst a completely brainless led by the nose moron, which as I said in my reply to Hic's insulting reply is p***ing me off totally.
To be honest my personal opinion is that Saint Theresa is working to keep us as close as possible to the EU, with the back room collaboration of the EU, and that the UK will re-apply to join as soon as she thinks she can get away with it, with all the rigmarole that will bring upon us.
It is also my personal opinion that if those voters who, like Hic, didn't bother to vote, had actually voted then we would have stayed in. It seems to me it was a case of " we won't bother, because we'll stay in anyway".
Still, it will all come out in the wash, so have a nice day, Jim.

[Jim B]

Outasite
I always try to be polite though sometimes a comment can be misconstrued and people take offence which is never my intention.
My take on the EU is that ordinary people like me have benefited immensely over the years. I started working in the construction industry in the late sixties and to be honest safety was none existent and it was one of the most dangerous industries (apart from coal mining) to work in. The EU changed all that by introducing safety reforms that made the industry much safer. We now go 5 or 6 or 7 million worked hours on a project without a lost time accident.
I've seen and worked on massive projects funded by the EU; I know we give the EU money but we get most of it back and it's directed at projects outside the South East. I know the EU isn't perfect but the whole of the population benefits from it rather than just isolated pockets that are favoured by selective government's.

Jim

[Jimgward]

Jim B - that's a very good point that re-directed funding is put into projects in areas outside the SE, where the level of social deprivation is lowest.

Without EU funding, I don't believe that Colleges ad Universities in the rest of the country would have thrived. All governments since and including Thatcher, have focussed more on London than any other area. It has now grown to the extent that it's too large for the country. The focus on financial earnings have made us incredibly susceptible to worldwide market fluctuations and nobody knows what result Brexit will have on the financial sector.

[outasite]

Outasite
I always try to be polite though sometimes a comment can be misconstrued and people take offence which is never my intention.
My take on the EU is that ordinary people like me have benefited immensely over the years. I started working in the construction industry in the late sixties and to be honest safety was none existent and it was one of the most dangerous industries (apart from coal mining) to work in. The EU changed all that by introducing safety reforms that made the industry much safer. We now go 5 or 6 or 7 million worked hours on a project without a lost time accident.
I've seen and worked on massive projects funded by the EU; I know we give the EU money but we get most of it back and it's directed at projects outside the South East. I know the EU isn't perfect but the whole of the population benefits from it rather than just isolated pockets that are favoured by selective government's.

Jim

I respect your opinion Jim. You are, as you say, polite et al. I too benefitted from being in the EU. I spent 14 years in Cyprus before coming home last December, I had a serious operation in Cyprus, free due my age, so I am aware of the benefits. But, it is something we didn't vote for, it has been introduced slowly slowly, and IMHO showed it's true colours with the taking of people's money from Cyprus banks, legitimising it with jargon about haircuts. No other EU country has suffered this indignity which is amazing as a lot of those countries owe a sight more than little old Cyprus did.
So when ( still when, although many wish it was if) we do part company I will be somewhat relieved but sad that , if I believe the doomsayers, I will no longer be able to visit my daughter and family in Ireland, no longer have a sun guaranteed holiday, but glad that I will still be able to get halloumi. The funny thing about flying to Dublin from England is I have to show my passport at Dubkin Immigration. But when I fly back, I bypass UK Immigration as the arrival is classed as domestic. I wonder if that will continue. Who knows. Totally out of our hands whatever happens.

[bromerzz]

We need to ensure tit for tat systems are established with the EU once we finally get out. Tit for Tat for all eventualities. If for example we have to wait at Immigration desks in Europe then make sure EU - non British Passport holders have to do the same on entering and leaving our Borders,

[Jim B]

We need to ensure tit for tat systems are established with the EU once we finally get out. Tit for Tat for all eventualities. If for example we have to wait at Immigration desks in Europe then make sure EU - non British Passport holders have to do the same on entering and leaving our Borders,

So you believe we should punish the EU because we can't have what we want?
Jim

[Jimgym]

We need to ensure tit for tat systems are established with the EU once we finally get out. Tit for Tat for all eventualities. If for example we have to wait at Immigration desks in Europe then make sure EU - non British Passport holders have to do the same on entering and leaving our Borders,

So you believe we should punish the EU because we can't have what we want?
Jim

I believe he means that we treat other nations the same way they treat us. Reciprocal arrangements are fair in my opinion.

[bromerzz]

Yes that is my view treat them as they treat us. Tit for tat.

[Jim B]

That's going to be difficult; it's taking up to 2 hours to transit Heathrow passport control, Amsterdam, Malta, Portugal takes about 20 minutes to go through the non EU gates so we're going to have to up our tat or is it tit

Jim

[Jim B]

I found this article interesting, there is a list of 84 papers (gone up from 70) to be issued by the UK government relating to a no deal Brexit and the effects it will have on the UK. One paper refers to "UK citizens in the EU" which I wait to read with baited breath. No doubt that old favourite "Project Fear" will be rolled out but it appears these days all the "project fearing" is being published by the Leave Lobby.

"No Deal" Brexit Papers Will Cover 84 Areas Of British Life
Papers on the consequences of leaving the EU without an agreement will cover topics from broadcasting to blood safety, according to a list seen by BuzzFeed News.

https://www.buzzfeed.com/alexspence/a-n ... .fakqz7NPR

Jim

[Devil]

Can't open your buzzfeed. I will never inscribe personal details on a doubtful US website pontificating on a UK subject.

[Jim B]

Opens for me and you don't have to "Inscribe" to read it. Buzzfeed has been around for quite a while and covers international news just like the Huffington or Reuters. there is no pontificating in the article, just straight reporting.

Jim

[Dominic]

Agreed. Buzzfeed is not a doubtful website by any stretch of the imagination.

[Firefly]

More might/might not papers, yawn.

[Jim B]

Strange, the government has stated it's going to publish papers spelling out the affected areas of British life if there is no deal, in batches starting in August but it appears you don't believe what the government is announcing. The government stated there would be about 70 papers but Buzzfeed said they were given a leaked list of 84. Most of the comments or quotes come from The Times (a leading Brexit newspaper) and also these papers were ordered by David Davis. If it is more/more it is coming from the Brexiteers Leaders who are backtracking faster than an Italian tank.
Jim

[kingfisher]

Good evening to you Jim. A small point, but the Times, and Sunday Times, are actually pro-remain.
It says so in this article in the Guardian, so it must be true!
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... sun-brexit

Jon.