Cyprus; Living the Dream, or is it a nightmare?

[Steve - SJD]

My husband and I were two of those immigrants. We had to prove our identity, that we could afford to live in Cyprus, pay for health insurance, and rightly so. We had booklets telling us that we were registered as Aliens, after much investigation.

You will find that many of the immigrants in the UK work, pay taxes and contribute yet still get tarred with the same brush as the minority. As you say you were immigrants but now think that other like minded people should not be afforded the same opportunity you have had.

Like I said previously, in England they were attacking businesses, places of worship, and people who did not appear to them to be British - would it tried to be explained away so easily if it happened in Cyprus?

For a family of four, the Aspen card would provide just short of £200 per week, or £10,400 per annum, if my maths are correct, not bad for doing nothing.

Well as you also said, it doesn't appear to be that many families, but regardless they are doing nothing because they are forced to do nothing as they are not allowed to work - not their rules. If your maths are also correct you will be aware that works out at just over £7 per person per day to cover all meals, clothes, toiletries - an amount determined to be the bare minimum needed to survive - not their figures.

The questions I ask is, if the life they have left was so bad, how can they afford to pay the people who provide the boats, and why do they dump their mobiles in the sea, and then have one provided by us, and why have they, mainly, left the women children to face conditions that they have left. No-one tells me.

Perhaps it wasn't always so bad and they worked and saved money for a better future only to see the countries they live in descend into war either civil or by external forces. Remember we are British by birth and also by luck - we are lucky to have been born in the UK - however we could just as welll have been born anywhere else.

As to why they leave women and children behind - there are various reasons and I cannot say I know them all - however a few come to mind. In many of the countries they are fleeing it is the men who are either forced to fight or alternatively be killed - neither option is appetizing so they leave. The journey is particularly treacherous for females/children who may either be kidnapped, sexually exploited or as the numbers show are more likely to die on the journey. The earning potential of men is higher than that of women hence it makes sense for those with the best opportunity of earning money to go, get established and a job, earn money and eventually bring the wife & children when safe to do so or send the money back to them so that they can move from there location.

If we had to flee a country and based on some of the considerations above - what would we do?

Just to be clear, I do think the number of people coming in illegally is too high and we need to look at all legal and humane options at reducing that number. I also think that of course there will be some people amongst them that are less than desirable to have in the country - no one wants that and totally understand the concerns.

However, people rarely differentiate between those coming to the country legally that the country needs, those coming in illegally, and those that have lived and even born there for many years.

Cheers

Steve

[memory man]

An article in the Cyprus Mail:-

This is why I left Cyprus

Clearly far more people want to come to Cyprus than leave.’ But still, not everyone loves living on our island...
In 2010, Stavros Makrides left Cyprus. It was, he thought, a temporary move.

“I went to study in the UK,” he reveals. “And I never came back. Why? Because I’d never have made enough money to survive in Cyprus…”

In the most recent round of the European Social Survey 60 per cent of Cyprus’ respondents claimed to be ‘extremely dissatisfied’ with the state of the island’s economy – one of the highest rates in Europe. And money is a reason often cited by those who leave – at just over €27,000 a year, the average Cyprus salary is definitely on the lower end of the wage scale.

READ MORE

[Chaddy]

An article in the Cyprus Mail:-

This is why I left Cyprus

Clearly far more people want to come to Cyprus than leave.’ But still, not everyone loves living on our island...
In 2010, Stavros Makrides left Cyprus. It was, he thought, a temporary move.

“I went to study in the UK,” he reveals. “And I never came back. Why? Because I’d never have made enough money to survive in Cyprus…”

In the most recent round of the European Social Survey 60 per cent of Cyprus’ respondents claimed to be ‘extremely dissatisfied’ with the state of the island’s economy – one of the highest rates in Europe. And money is a reason often cited by those who leave – at just over €27,000 a year, the average Cyprus salary is definitely on the lower end of the wage scale.

READ MORE

I would say your figure of 27,000 euros a year is rather on the top side.

[Firefly]

Steve

Thank you for your reply.

I can't agree with many of your points, but we will have to agree to differ I think.

As for fleeing in the face of war, it's a good job my grandfather and his generation, and my father and his generation, fought for our freedom, or we wouldn't be so lucky to day. Would they have legged it elsewhere for safety, having left their families to face the foe, I think not.

I do think that there is more to this mass illegal immigration than meets the eye, but that's sadly for my grandchildren to experience I think.

[galexinda]

Steve - SJD

1. Just read your most recent post which included responses to various points raised by Firefly.

2. Just read your most recent post again (without the references to Firefly) and I think this is a very balanced overview of the current situation.

This is a complex humanitarian issue which has to be viewed in its wider context and with an open mind.

[lotus]

As someone who lately has been spending a lot of time in uk(Worcester ) I find that the bulk of foreigners are generally lovely people,hard working and polite especially Indian,Phillipenos ,Polish etc,where would the likes of the NHS and transport systems be without them ?Ok there are some bad ones amongst them ,drugs especially but overall uk would be in the poop without them,then you get the illegal immigrants which are a different matter,costing the country millions everyday ,keep the few good ones and along with a lot of bone idle English people who are too lazy to work ship them off to Rwanda like the previous government wanted

[WHL]

Ive spent a bit more time then ive wanted visiting family in hospital back in london, most of the nurses and doctors were asian , they looked after our family as if they were their own, these people on here moaning about immigrants should hung their heads in shame, the vast majority of NHS workers work their arses off caring for others and not for a lot of money, I know who i would want living next door to me and it wouldn't be these Farage lovers.

[lotus]

Totally agree WHL re the nurses and doctors,fantastic job they do under such chaotic conditions in the hospitals and nearly always with a smile!

[jeba]

Of course, you can´t paint skilled workers who are in the country legally with the same brush as those who reside in Europe illegally. And of course, you can´t paint all the illegal ones with the same brush einther. However, the fact remains that they are overrepresented among prison inmates. I remember the stats for my home state of Bavaria, where in 2017 49% of prison inmates were foreigners. The foreign Microsoft manager will probably be less likely to commit crimes than a jobless refugee who doesn´t even speak the language.
You can´t ignore that either.

[Steve - SJD]

Of course, you can´t paint skilled workers who are in the country legally with the same brush as those who reside in Europe illegally. And of course, you can´t paint all the illegal ones with the same brush einther.

But that's exactly what people are doing - conflating all together and for good measure including those born there.

However, the fact remains that they are overrepresented among prison inmates. I remember the stats for my home state of Bavaria, where in 2017 49% of prison inmates were foreigners.

No of course it can't be ignored - I don't know enough about Germany but it does look to have a very high foreign prisoner population - a brief look found interestingly that the "most common nationalities among detainees include Turks, Poles, Syrians, Afghans, Algerians as well as Russians".

In the UK however the situation is different, not to be downplayed, but the level of foreign nationals in prison in 2023 was 12% or in real numbers - 10,321 people who will likely be subject to a deportation order on completion of their prison term. Again interestingly "over half of foreign prisoners were European and, overall, the most common nationalities were Albanian, Polish, Romanian, Irish, and Jamaican."

10,321 is still high and the justice system needs to look at shipping those people out as quickly as possible.

However, does the figure match the perception and the soundbites?

Cheers

Steve

[Steve - SJD]

As for fleeing in the face of war, it's a good job my grandfather and his generation, and my father and his generation, fought for our freedom, or we wouldn't be so lucky to day. Would they have legged it elsewhere for safety, having left their families to face the foe, I think not.

We have much to be thankful for in relation to the service of past generations who fought for our freedoms - remembering that included many thousands from the empire and beyond.

In reality though the situations are not really comparable.

I agree we will have to agree to disagree on this topic.

Cheers

Steve