Terrible tower block fire in London

[Dominic]

And lets not forget the summer riots a few years ago. Neither stoic nor especially ethnic.

Besides, the tower block protesters have got a genuine beef, unlike the rioters.

[Poppy]

Of course there is a lack of information as firefighters have only just managed to get to the top of the building and now starts the horrendous task of recovering and identifying the bodies. I think from all accounts that the surviving residents are being helped. They have been told that it is not possible at this time to re-house all of them in the same area but rehome them they will. Do you not think that those former residemts might just be too busy trying to get rehomed and some possessions togethef to protest at this time and that the main violent protesters are not the former residents?

[WHL]

Personally im sick and tired of watching these self publicist celebrity hug a victim, coming out of the woodwork every time there is a disaster,..If celebs like Lilly Allen, are so concerned about where these unfortunate people, will sleep after losing their homes, why not offer to put them up for a while in their mansions, that goes for the Queen too, she has a few hundred spare rooms, paid for by us peasants... which could be put to good use in a crises..

[Varky]

Lloyd I presume that you have now seen on tv that she both visited survivors both in church and in hospital. The media even commented on her expression. Was she supposed to be laughing? It appears that everyone is out to get her in a real witch hunt and it is not nice at all.

That was her second visit, probably made because she didn't get it right first time around

[Varky]

Of course there is a lack of information as firefighters have only just managed to get to the top of the building and now starts the horrendous task of recovering and identifying the bodies. I think from all accounts that the surviving residents are being helped. They have been told that it is not possible at this time to re-house all of them in the same area but rehome them they will. Do you not think that those former residemts might just be too busy trying to get rehomed and some possessions togethef to protest at this time and that the main violent protesters are not the former residents?

In this we agree. From what I saw, the violent protesters were from outside of the area pushing a political agenda. The locals tried to calm things down by shouting 'peace'.

[WHL]

Of course there is a lack of information as firefighters have only just managed to get to the top of the building and now starts the horrendous task of recovering and identifying the bodies. I think from all accounts that the surviving residents are being helped. They have been told that it is not possible at this time to re-house all of them in the same area but rehome them they will. Do you not think that those former residemts might just be too busy trying to get rehomed and some possessions togethef to protest at this time and that the main violent protesters are not the former residents?

In this we agree. From what I saw, the violent protesters were from outside of the area pushing a political agenda. The locals tried to calm things down by shouting 'peace'.

You dont know that...your just guessing, what is a fact, May has been shown to be incompetent, as a leader and is being advised by a bunch of Idiots....the sad thing for the UK is the only alternative is Jeremy...God help us.

[Poppy]

I think you will find that the first time around she visited the emergency services. I cannot see anything wrong with that. I have just been watching again the crowd abusing the police,the very men and women who have worked so hard and they do not deserve this abuse.

[WHL]

Nothing wrong in visiting the Rescue service's /Police, but not taking a minute to speak to the locals, was a very poor decision on Mays part...however anyone tries to spin it....this snub probably angered the locals, resulting in the the anger towards the Police.

[Poppy]

Sorry but that is rubbish!! They think they have been snubbed by the PM and take it out on the Police!?There are activists out there who are using this terrible tragedy to get rid of the PM - absolutely shocking!

[WHL]

With respect, Its you thats Posting Rubbish....Simple Question to you...Did May meet any locals on her first visit to the fire?
http://www.lbc.co.uk/radio/presenters/n ... d-victims/

[Poppy]

No . I have never said that she did. She prioritised,arguably wrongly,and . met with the service personnel. The 2nd visit was to hospitals and residents in the church. My point,which you chose to ignore, was that it was totally wrong for the crowd to direct their anger at the police who have seen and will continue to see in the coming days,sights that no one should have to and they deserve respect not abuse.

[WHL]

No . I have never said that she did. She prioritised,arguably wrongly,and . met with the service personnel. The 2nd visit was to hospitals and residents in the church. My point,which you chose to ignore, was that it was totally wrong for the crowd to direct their anger at the police who have seen and will continue to see in the coming days,sights that no one should have to and they deserve respect not abuse.

No I didn't ignore your point,,, if you read what I said...her Stupid decision not to meet the residents, contributed to the residents anger ..which in turn was used against the Police....you can spin it till the cows come home...this was a mega mistake by May and her advisers...and she isnt fit to lead a country....as for the London Mayor I cant stand the little twit, but credit where credits due he had the Balls to go into an angry crowd and take it on the chin...May has shown a Yellow streak, which dosnt befit a so called leader.

[Jimgward]

Theresa May interview on BBC2. She is out of her depth' unable to answer straight questions; Maybot is a good analogy. Car crash TV and sadly, I take no joy from watching her squirm and avoid. She isn't a proper leader. This isn't a hatchet job by the BBC. TM asked for a specific interview and interviewer. She tried, with her team, to control it, with set stock answers. It doesn't work.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ftY1NlPk5YY

[Dominic]

Hmmm, I would need to know what their pre 2016 brochures said about the product before passing judgement. A warning in a 2016 brochure wouldn't have been read by the procurement team, given the timescale of the project.

[Jimgward]

England has largely privatised building control services. They have different standards (lower) than the rest 0f the UK.

Scotland, for example, fits sprinklers in all buildings above 4 storeys, including renovations. Some councils even fit them to 2 storey buildings as standard.

Question need asked as to why government ministers have sat on recommendations, ignored warnings and buried information. They are as guilty as the builders

[Dominic]

Strange observation. Are you suggesting that the architect responsible wouldn't have made it his task to ascertain the cladding material's fireworthiness credentials? Duty of care and all that. Apparently there are two main types of cladding: that which has a fireproof core...and that which hasn't. Do you think this technology is so new that it's properties were only known about and published in 2016?

It was the responsibility - indeed duty - of ALL the personnel and companies involved in the refurbishment to know exactly what they were applying to the walls.

I don't know why you find it strange. If you are holding up a brochure as evidence of malpractice, you should make it a brochure that the contractors would have actually seen.

[Firefly]

I have to say that the disturbances last evening came as no surprise to me ! Rent a mob are alive and well sadly.

Poppy

I agree with your sentiments completely, it's madness to blame the Police for any and every incident, either accidental or deliberate. They are the front line, and trained to deal with mobs, but sadly The Riot Act was repealed, quite wrongly in my view. They must be better armed to deal with riots, water cannon and tear gas would be a start, standing there with a shield doesn't worry anyone. I find the use of horses absolutely dreadful poor things. I fear that we have not seen the last of these demonstrations, we shall see.

Jackie

[josef k]

To dismiss the relatives and friends of those killed in the fire as "rent-a-mob" is cruel and uncaring. It's easy to call people anarchists, and so give yourself permission to ignore them. It would be interesting to note how comments would change if the fire was just down the road in the most affluent part of the UK.
Those protesting are understandably angry and don't see appropriate action being taken and already see promises being broken. The PM said people would be rehoused close to home, yet they are being sent to other boroughs in London. The PM couldn't meet with residents due to security issues, but the Queen was able to. The PM calls a public enquiry (with she can control) rather than a public inquest which the relatives would have input to.
Frankly, if I was a relative I would be part of the "rent-a-mob" given how the issue was being dealt with.

[Jimgward]

May is now meeting residents, council workers and government ministers at Downing Street.

Interesting and not before time. I wonder if the residents demand answers, that they'll be sought and given. Also wonder if she will allow an inquest. She seems to think throwing money at it is an answer, when the anger is about it happening in the first place after warnings, and how so many died after being told to stay in their flats.

In some countries, people would already be in custody.

[WHL]

To dismiss the relatives and friends of those killed in the fire as "rent-a-mob" is cruel and uncaring. It's easy to call people anarchists, and so give yourself permission to ignore them. It would be interesting to note how comments would change if the fire was just down the road in the most affluent part of the UK.
Those protesting are understandably angry and don't see appropriate action being taken and already see promises being broken. The PM said people would be rehoused close to home, yet they are being sent to other boroughs in London. The PM couldn't meet with residents due to security issues, but the Queen was able to. The PM calls a public enquiry (with she can control) rather than a public inquest which the relatives would have input to.
Frankly, if I was a relative I would be part of the "rent-a-mob" given how the issue was being dealt with.

Good post but if there are no free council houses near by then they have to go anywhere there is spare housing.