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Re: Vote of no confidence
Posted: Sat Dec 15, 2018 8:32 am
by Jim B
Ramone wrote: ↑Sat Dec 15, 2018 4:19 am
.......... And after what I seen on the news last night about the way the UK PM is being treated then the UK should just walk away & leave them to it.
I really can't get my head around this comment about the " treatment" of TM. Last week she agrees a deal with the EU and this week goes back and tried to change it. The EU confirmed it would provide assurances but would stick to the agreement. Where is the disrespect or poor treatment in that or is the assumed poor treatment because they wouldn't give in to all her demands?
Jim
Re: Vote of no confidence
Posted: Sat Dec 15, 2018 9:42 am
by jeba
Ramone wrote: ↑Sat Dec 15, 2018 4:19 am
They have already had a vote & the majority voted to leave. So get on with it.
Isn´t that a bit like arguing that your family decided to buy a Rolls Royce without knowing the price and now being refused to change their decision once they know it?
Re: Vote of no confidence
Posted: Sat Dec 15, 2018 12:55 pm
by Ramone
Lets keep going back to polls until we get the result you want eh??
Re: Vote of no confidence
Posted: Sat Dec 15, 2018 2:35 pm
by Firefly
Utter madness, when will people accept that we voted, what's this nonsense about a 'peoples vote', we had one, not that it matters anyway, as I see it we will never be free of the clutches of the EU.
Jackie
Re: Vote of no confidence
Posted: Sat Dec 15, 2018 3:38 pm
by Jim B
Ramone wrote: ↑Sat Dec 15, 2018 12:55 pm
Lets keep going back to polls until we get the result you want eh??
Why not, that's how democracy works; it's not a one off game.
Jim
Re: Vote of no confidence
Posted: Sat Dec 15, 2018 4:35 pm
by ApusApus
Firefly wrote: ↑Sat Dec 15, 2018 2:35 pm
Utter madness, when will people accept that we voted, what's this nonsense about a 'peoples vote', we had one, not that it matters anyway, as I see it we will never be free of the clutches of the EU.
Jackie
You are right, we did have a vote and there was a majority but I guess it was the wrong kind of majority ………………… just like it was the wrong kind of snow for British Rail back in the 90's! If you look at the numbers, 33.5M people voted in Brexit which was a turnout of over 72% and out of those 52% voted to leave? If that doesn't equate to a "peoples vote" then I don't know what does?
Shane
Re: Vote of no confidence
Posted: Sun Dec 16, 2018 8:55 am
by jeba
Firefly wrote: ↑Sat Dec 15, 2018 2:35 pm
Utter madness, when will people accept that we voted, what's this nonsense about a 'peoples vote', we had one, not that it matters anyway,
Exactly, legally it doesn´t matter as it´s not binding. There shouldn´t be referenda like that in the first place. If I was British and if I believed in referenda though I´d be furious about not to be given a chance to make a final decision once I know the details of what such a decision entailed.
Re: Vote of no confidence
Posted: Sun Dec 16, 2018 9:18 am
by trevnhil
One of the problems is that people thought the first decision was FINAL.
If there is a second vote... will that decision be a Final one ? Or will there be a third vote ??
Re: Vote of no confidence
Posted: Sun Dec 16, 2018 10:09 am
by kingfisher
Trevnhil- The vote would only need to be re-run until the establishment prevailed, in this case the EU.
See Ireland, Greece, and Denmark for examples.
Jon.
Re: Vote of no confidence
Posted: Sun Dec 16, 2018 12:11 pm
by Jim B
Trev
Are you referring to the referendum in 1975? I thought that was it when I voted yes.
Jim
Re: Vote of no confidence
Posted: Sun Dec 16, 2018 12:35 pm
by kingfisher
Jim, I don’t think the Common Market of a few countries in 1975 was the remotely comparable to the present EU.
What, if any, are the similarities between the two in constitution and social/economic and political consequences?
Importantly, almost two generations have passed between the two votes, which is a fair period.
Jon.
Re: Vote of no confidence
Posted: Sun Dec 16, 2018 3:50 pm
by Firefly
The Common Market has morphed into a monster that has us in it's clutches, I do not believe that we will ever be free from the EU, we are too wealthy a nation to let go, and we must be punished like a naughty child, to serve as a lesson to other countries who may wish to leave at some future time.
If we EVER have Brexit and I'm still alive, I will celebrate together with my family, as it is, I am beginning to doubt that we will leave the EU. I would prefer a hard Brexit to Mrs. May's proposals, which still tie us in but without a voice, not good for us as I see it. I know that isn't popular with remainers, but if we're to leave, then that's what we should do, leave.
Jackie
Re: Vote of no confidence
Posted: Sun Dec 16, 2018 5:36 pm
by ApusApus
trevnhil wrote: ↑Sun Dec 16, 2018 9:18 am
One of the problems is that people thought the first decision was FINAL.
If there is a second vote... will that decision be a Final one ? Or will there be a third vote ??
No, there will be a concerted push for a third one in the event of a second vote and we will all sit in this continued state of limbo while it's thrashed out!
Shane
Re: Vote of no confidence
Posted: Wed Dec 19, 2018 9:50 am
by Uncle D
Whatever happens, hard, soft or remain the UK will be in a worse situation than it was before the referendum.
Tighten your seat belts we are in for a long rough ride.
Re: Vote of no confidence
Posted: Wed Dec 19, 2018 12:20 pm
by Jimgward
ApusApus wrote: ↑Sun Dec 16, 2018 5:36 pm
trevnhil wrote: ↑Sun Dec 16, 2018 9:18 am
One of the problems is that people thought the first decision was FINAL.
If there is a second vote... will that decision be a Final one ? Or will there be a third vote ??
No, there will be a concerted push for a third one in the event of a second vote and we will all sit in this continued state of limbo while it's thrashed out!
Shane
Not if the vote is constructed properly. The vote for devolution needed a 2/3rds majority.
A huge change like this should have been defined properly or a second ratifying referendum, like in Eire, structured in. Cameron made a complete cockup
Re: Vote of no confidence
Posted: Wed Dec 19, 2018 12:22 pm
by Jimgward
Firefly wrote: ↑Sun Dec 16, 2018 3:50 pm
The Common Market has morphed into a monster that has us in it's clutches, I do not believe that we will ever be free from the EU, we are too wealthy a nation to let go, and we must be punished like a naughty child, to serve as a lesson to other countries who may wish to leave at some future time.
If we EVER have Brexit and I'm still alive, I will celebrate together with my family, as it is, I am beginning to doubt that we will leave the EU. I would prefer a hard Brexit to Mrs. May's proposals, which still tie us in but without a voice, not good for us as I see it. I know that isn't popular with remainers, but if we're to leave, then that's what we should do, leave.
Jackie
I sincerely hope that you can celebrate with your family, but I am skeptical as to whether it will be a celebration. Much more remorse.
Re: Vote of no confidence
Posted: Wed Dec 19, 2018 5:51 pm
by Firefly
Jim
Each to their own.
Re: Vote of no confidence
Posted: Wed Dec 19, 2018 7:37 pm
by ApusApus
Jimgward wrote: ↑Wed Dec 19, 2018 12:20 pm
Not if the vote is constructed properly. The vote for devolution needed a 2/3rds majority.
A huge change like this should have been defined properly or a second ratifying referendum, like in Eire, structured in. Cameron made a complete cockup
You have a deluded view of reality Jimgward, were you championing this when Cameron announced the "first" referendum ………… I think not?
Shane
Re: Vote of no confidence
Posted: Wed Dec 19, 2018 7:57 pm
by Jimgward
Well, you think wrong, yet again, Shane..... I said from the outset, that ANY referendum for such a drastic change, should have needed a large majority and should have been properly worded with proper choices.... i.e. not just Stay or Leave...
My ‘delusion’ as you put it, will prove 100% correct, when you see the outcome of a hard brexit... prepare yourself for drastically falling pound, property prices in Cyprus and elsewhere and much more....
Re: Vote of no confidence
Posted: Wed Dec 19, 2018 9:04 pm
by ApusApus
Yep, deluded sounds about right to me, you seem to be the only person that knows 100% what the outcome will be …………… well actually not the only one but let's not go there? And why would you think that I need to prepare for a falling pound/property prices in Cyprus, quite frankly it makes no difference to me? Maybe, as a business owner, you should be one of those looking to grasp the opportunities that Brexit presents and stop winging about the potential negatives!
Shane