Heat Pump v Aircon

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Expresspete
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Heat Pump v Aircon

Post by Expresspete »

Apologies if this has been covered before but I would really like some advice/input before I splash the cash please?
We’ve just bought a property in Peyia (which has Gas central heating) and my plan is to install pv net metering (hopefully a 4kw system) as well as a Solar pool pump and an all new replacement Air conditioning system, which we’re led to believe, will heat the house in the winter and cool in the summer. However, my prospective supplier/installer has thrown a curve ball into the mix by suggesting I should add a Heat Pump to convert the gas to electric (we don’t have underfloor heating and don’t want the expense and mess of digging the floor up) to my order, explaining that over time we would save thousands of €.
As a novice to the energy and cost saving game can anyone give me the pro’s and con’s of adding said Heat Pump as well as a split aircon system, in other words would I need a Heat Pump if the Aircon is doing the heating and cooling already? Obviously, if the air con heat & cool system is sufficient it would make the central heating redundant.
Hopefully this has all made sense! Thank you in advance for your knowledgable advice. Pete
Living the Sunshine dream 8-)
trevnhil
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Re: Heat Pump v Aircon

Post by trevnhil »

Hi Pete. I don't have enough knowledge to advise you about all the things you have questions about.
What I do know is that we had a PV system installed around 6 years ago and have never regretted it.
But we do only use it as a saving on Electrics.
We do have Gas fired Central heating with ordinary radiators. Again we have no regrets in having that installed when we had our bungalow built. But we do have insulated walls and ceilings

However other people will give you advice, BUT they could do with more information.
Has your property got just a single brick wall..

Do you have a flat concrete roof, or do you have a pitched roof with a 'loft'
What insulation do you have, ie Roof insulation? Double glazing ?? Do you have UPVC windows or aluminium ones?
Insulation is a big thing to have if you are able to install it

Good luck with your endeavours to keep warm at a good price
Trev..
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cyprusmax47
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Re: Heat Pump v Aircon

Post by cyprusmax47 »

Expresspete wrote: Thu Sep 22, 2022 10:34 am Apologies if this has been covered before but I would really like some advice/input before I splash the cash please?
We’ve just bought a property in Peyia (which has Gas central heating) and my plan is to install pv net metering (hopefully a 4kw system) as well as a Solar pool pump and an all new replacement Air conditioning system, which we’re led to believe, will heat the house in the winter and cool in the summer. However, my prospective supplier/installer has thrown a curve ball into the mix by suggesting I should add a Heat Pump to convert the gas to electric (we don’t have underfloor heating and don’t want the expense and mess of digging the floor up) to my order, explaining that over time we would save thousands of €.
As a novice to the energy and cost saving game can anyone give me the pro’s and con’s of adding said Heat Pump as well as a split aircon system, in other words would I need a Heat Pump if the Aircon is doing the heating and cooling already? Obviously, if the air con heat & cool system is sufficient it would make the central heating redundant.
Hopefully this has all made sense! Thank you in advance for your knowledgable advice. Pete
Heat Pumps for central heating instead of gas/diesel is the only way in the near future to have comfort in Winter also here in Cyprus. Nobody knows how the supply of gas/heating diesel will continue with the war in Ukraine, but electricity we will have all the time. Both prices will rise further, however if you have a large enough PV-netmetering system you will reduce your e-bill a lot.

Specially in CY where the Winter temperatures in most places don't fall below 5c, all Heat Pumps (air-cons as well) will work very efficient as they use the outside temperature, unlike places in Germany where you can get many days with very low temperatures like -15c and then they don't work efficient. But saying that, many households in Germany have underfloor heating which are ideal for heat pumps also with low temperature outside.

It is not everybody happy to run only air-cons for heating, however it is the cheaper version in the first place. We are lucky here in CY that there is still some stock at this moment in Heat Pumps for central heating, however very soon we will have the same situation as Germany, where delivery time for the components is minimum 1/2 year, while prices are rising by the week.

So if you want my opinion: go for Heat Pump if you have the funds and if not, you perhaps delay the installation of new air-cons until next spring.
You mentioned pool pump, also this is a must right now, as it needs no permits and you safe electricity from the first day installed...

Max
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Expresspete
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Re: Heat Pump v Aircon

Post by Expresspete »

Hi Trevnhil, afraid there is no insulation (single brick walls and no loft space either. Doors and windows are UPVC although not double glazed….thank you for your good wishes.
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Expresspete
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Re: Heat Pump v Aircon

Post by Expresspete »

Hi Max, thanks once again for your advice, you have been very helpful this last month or so
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Re: Heat Pump v Aircon

Post by Poppy »

I am not technical at all but cyprus max is of course. All I would say is that when we lived there the Landlord actually put central heating in for us BUT without insulation the heat goes straight out of the walls!! I have seen insulation added to existing homes which might be the best option to spend your money on? I am sure someone else will know more about this than me
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Devil
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Re: Heat Pump v Aircon

Post by Devil »

I would agree with Poppy. I am technically minded and have now modified the house with wall insulation, roof insulation, double glazed sealed windows, heating means and various other more or less expensive changes. Believe me, well worth it as Poppy says. Yes, it's quite an expensive menu but a lot of it can be paid for by the government.
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cyprusmax47
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Re: Heat Pump v Aircon

Post by cyprusmax47 »

Expresspete wrote: Thu Sep 22, 2022 5:03 pm Hi Max, thanks once again for your advice, you have been very helpful this last month or so
You are welcome.

My opinion is that you have to first upgrade the "green standard" of your new home, investing first in photovoltaic, heat pump for central heating and solar pool pump. Of course it is always best if the insulation of the house is good, and windows are at least double glazed (better triple) and perhaps outside shutters installed, however this will be ever so expensive and time consuming ( a mess for a very long time) and will not give you the cheap electricity you need SOON before Winter arrives. Good insulation alone does not keep your house comfortable in colder month, what you need is the above mentioned "Green" installation measures, which will be more or less outside the house and done in a short time without interfering indoors too much...

Max
glang3000
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Re: Heat Pump v Aircon

Post by glang3000 »

I believe if you have a heat pump installed you will also have to replace the radiators as the heating will be working at a lower temperature.
trevnhil
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Re: Heat Pump v Aircon

Post by trevnhil »

In my mind, I am struggling to understand why you would need to do this. Hopefully Max will comment
Trev..
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Lincoln
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Re: Heat Pump v Aircon

Post by Lincoln »

trevnhil, I have sent you a PM.
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trevnhil
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Re: Heat Pump v Aircon

Post by trevnhil »

I have not received one up to now..
Trev..
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cyprusmax47
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Re: Heat Pump v Aircon

Post by cyprusmax47 »

glang3000 wrote: Sat Sep 24, 2022 7:24 pm I believe if you have a heat pump installed you will also have to replace the radiators as the heating will be working at a lower temperature.
Not only photovoltaic modules are more efficient nowadays, also air-to-water heat pumps for central heating are more advanced now. Normal heat pumps are designed for a maximum flow temperature of 55-60 degrees Celsius, which would be good enough for our Cyprus Winter conditions. In order to provide higher flow temperatures, you would need a model that is specially developed for this: a high-temperature heat pump. Thanks to special technology, it is able to reach flow temperatures of up to 100 degrees. For this purpose, both special refrigerants and components that can withstand the higher pressure that results from the greater compression are used, however as I said we are in Cyprus and such high flow temperatures are not necessary.

Max
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Re: Heat Pump v Aircon

Post by PolemIan »

I can’t comment on the heat pump side, but I would strongly recommend investing as much as you can in insulation - generating cheap energy that then goes through the walls is still a waste.

We live in the same village as Trevor, have a highly insulated kit house we imported from Scotland, a 3.12kw PV installation, off grid panels for the pool pump, no need for gas or logs and our electric bill for March 2021 - March 2022 after the crappiest, longest winter I’ve experienced here and only using AC for heating, was the grand total of €155 and a carry over of 827kw to this year.

Insulation is massively important - benefits all year round.

Ian
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Re: Heat Pump v Aircon

Post by Kili01 »

Can anyone recommend a reliable contractor for wall and roof insulation, Chloraka or Paphos based please?

Dee
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cyprusmax47
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Re: Heat Pump v Aircon

Post by cyprusmax47 »

trevnhil wrote: Sat Sep 24, 2022 8:12 pm In my mind, I am struggling to understand why you would need to do this. Hopefully Max will comment
I hope you are satisfied with my explanation concerning how heat pumps work....

Max
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Re: Heat Pump v Aircon

Post by trevnhil »

At the time I didn't see why you would need to change the radiators. Are you saying that they would all need changing ?
Trev..
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cyprusmax47
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Re: Heat Pump v Aircon

Post by cyprusmax47 »

trevnhil wrote: Wed Sep 28, 2022 10:10 am At the time I didn't see why you would need to change the radiators. Are you saying that they would all need changing ?
Not at all!! It is the opposite. If you read my explanation again you can see that I said 55-60c is enough for our Cyprus Winter conditions....

Max
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Re: Heat Pump v Aircon

Post by trevnhil »

glang3000 wrote: Sat Sep 24, 2022 7:24 pm I believe if you have a heat pump installed you will also have to replace the radiators as the heating will be working at a lower temperature.
So, glang3000 your belief about the radiators is not correct
Trev..
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Re: Heat Pump v Aircon

Post by glang3000 »

I have just been on a seminar about this exact subject about 2 weeks ago and the expert said they always change the radiators to high output ones as standard radiators will not have sufficient output but i don't know either way to be honest, I'm just a plumber.

I do know that Max says that 50c to 60 c in Cyprus would be enough but I think in winter Cyprus can be as cold as UK, perhaps with the extra insulation that has been suggested then standard rads would be OK.

Gary.
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