Light at the end of Boris' dark tunnel?

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Jimgward
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Re: Light at the end of Boris' dark tunnel?

Post by Jimgward »

Boris has vowed he will leave on 31st October, do or die. Would we hold him to it?
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Re: Light at the end of Boris' dark tunnel?

Post by Dominic »

It may be outside of his hands. One man does not a parliament make.
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Re: Light at the end of Boris' dark tunnel?

Post by kingfisher »

What a pity one man does not a parliament make in this situation, when 52% of the country which could rouse itself to vote, voted Leave, and yet there is a Remain majority in the house of 310- or 75%.
Needs someone strong to drain that swamp- I’ll not suggest the obvious candidate in case the very name causes extreme offence- or even apoplexy!
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Re: Light at the end of Boris' dark tunnel?

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The 2% majority has certainly gone - not only because of elderly deaths (predominately leavers) but every poll since has Remain at between 55 and over 60%.
Now, in a true democracy, we would get to vote on any deal or remain. We are a representative democracy, not a dictatorial democracy.
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Re: Light at the end of Boris' dark tunnel?

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Jimgward wrote: Sat Jul 20, 2019 11:52 pm The 2% majority has certainly gone - not only because of elderly deaths (predominately leavers) but every poll since has Remain at between 55 and over 60%.
Now, in a true democracy, we would get to vote on any deal or remain. We are a representative democracy, not a dictatorial democracy.
In a true democracy the outcome of the democratic vote would have been enacted. Those Remain voters who talk of democracy only want it when it suits their argument.
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Re: Light at the end of Boris' dark tunnel?

Post by Dominic »

In fairness to May, she did put forward a plan. Had the democratically elected parliament gone with it we would now be out. But they didn't.

Anybody who finds the idea of a vote on known outcomes as opposed to general ideas as undemocratic is frankly mistaken.

First, the government have to decide what exactly they want to happen, be it no deal or some plan, then they should ask the people if that's what they want.

Clearly a lot of people still want out, so it is no done deal. But people voted for things that just aren't going to happen. People should be allowed to vote on what is actual reality.
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Re: Light at the end of Boris' dark tunnel?

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Jimgym wrote: Sun Jul 21, 2019 1:06 pm
Jimgward wrote: Sat Jul 20, 2019 11:52 pm The 2% majority has certainly gone - not only because of elderly deaths (predominately leavers) but every poll since has Remain at between 55 and over 60%.
Now, in a true democracy, we would get to vote on any deal or remain. We are a representative democracy, not a dictatorial democracy.
In a true democracy the outcome of the democratic vote would have been enacted. Those Remain voters who talk of democracy only want it when it suits their argument.
That’s just totally not true. The referendum wasn’t a dictat, to leave or stay. It was advisory to our parliamentary democracy, as advisory of the feeling people. People who frankly didn’t fully understand what differences were on the table. Lots of lies, fabrications and scaremongering on both sides meant that people often latched onto one aspect and chose that as their decision.

People believed the notion that we had lost sovereignty - balderdash. People believed we had no control over immigration, not true.

There is enough evidence that the vote was ‘influenced’ by foreign illegal money. There is also evidence of lies. Enough that the vote itself should have been rerun.

We are now much worse off. The countries gdp has fallen significantly and don’t give me the crap about less unemployment. Million are on Zero-hour and minimal hour > 20 hour contracts. If these were aligned, unemployment figures would be millions. Social care, as an example, employs mainly women on 16 hour weeks - so that they receive benefits. What is that acceptable or even right?
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Re: Light at the end of Boris' dark tunnel?

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Has the democratic result of the referendum been implemented? NO. Have Remainers tried repeatedly to either quash the result, or stop it in any way they can? YES. And there are people who think this is democratic? Implement the result and then have another referendum if you don't like the result of the first one. The vote was simple one, and nowhere was it mentioned that Parliament, or the people would have a final say. Mainly I think due to the utter arrogance of the Reman camp who never believed they would lose.

Jim, you go on about foreign money, lies etc. Each time you write something you reinforce my comments. You disagree with the result as do many, which is your right, and you desperately latch on to anything to prove it wasn't fair, or correct and therefore we should remain.
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Re: Light at the end of Boris' dark tunnel?

Post by Jim B »

Jimgym wrote: Sun Jul 21, 2019 1:06 pm
Jimgward wrote: Sat Jul 20, 2019 11:52 pm The 2% majority has certainly gone - not only because of elderly deaths (predominately leavers) but every poll since has Remain at between 55 and over 60%.
Now, in a true democracy, we would get to vote on any deal or remain. We are a representative democracy, not a dictatorial democracy.
In a true democracy the outcome of the democratic vote would have been enacted. Those Remain voters who talk of democracy only want it when it suits their argument.
The below link confirms what Jim Ward wrote about the referendum. It was advisory.

Jim


https://www.lbc.co.uk/radio/presenters/ ... lt-stands/
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Re: Light at the end of Boris' dark tunnel?

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I know it was advisory, BUT the electorate were told by the PM that it was their decision, not anyone else's. Again, the voters weren't told it was only to be advisory, but their decision which as Cameron said, would be respected. Fairly clear cut to me. I'm sure there are plenty more straws for Remainers to clutch at, and I look forward to hearing, and reading them!
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Re: Light at the end of Boris' dark tunnel?

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Farage and Boris both said, very clearly, that if they had lost the referendum, they would immediately call for another and not stop until they got Brexit.

Farage is a bad smell that won't ever go away. He is a racist and fascist and a puppet of the ones who want to change the UK for their own benefit.
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Re: Light at the end of Boris' dark tunnel?

Post by Jim B »

Alan
Cameron was wrong to state that the referendum was anything more than advisory, it's that straight forward.
The High Court have confirmed the referendum was only advisory and that's why they couldn't make a judgement even though they agreed the referendum was flawed.
As I asked you several posts ago; where is the democracy when parties are putting 3 line whips on their MPs telling them which way to vote. The UK system is not very democratic, more a two party state.

Jim
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Re: Light at the end of Boris' dark tunnel?

Post by Jimgym »

Jim B wrote: Sun Jul 21, 2019 6:06 pm Alan
Cameron was wrong to state that the referendum was anything more than advisory, it's that straight forward.
The High Court have confirmed the referendum was only advisory and that's why they couldn't make a judgement even though they agreed the referendum was flawed.
As I asked you several posts ago; where is the democracy when parties are putting 3 line whips on their MPs telling them which way to vote. The UK system is not very democratic, more a two party state.

Jim
The P.M. stated what I said earlier. The vote was to leave, as everyone knows. That has been repeatedly blocked by Remainers who then cite (without irony) democracy. They are trying to implement what the majority who voted wanted. That's democracy, implementing the will of the people who bothered to vote.
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Re: Light at the end of Boris' dark tunnel?

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... and the vote was always flawed. No referendum for such an important event should ever be a one-off or based on over 50%. We did it wrong and it's torn the country apart.

We saw how Tory voters would rather have Brexit than preserve the UK. Brexit over almost anything else. Even if it means a poorer country, loss of jobs, increased prices. What is that all about?
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Re: Light at the end of Boris' dark tunnel?

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Jimgym wrote: Sun Jul 21, 2019 6:28 pm
Jim B wrote: Sun Jul 21, 2019 6:06 pm Alan
Cameron was wrong to state that the referendum was anything more than advisory, it's that straight forward.
The High Court have confirmed the referendum was only advisory and that's why they couldn't make a judgement even though they agreed the referendum was flawed.
As I asked you several posts ago; where is the democracy when parties are putting 3 line whips on their MPs telling them which way to vote. The UK system is not very democratic, more a two party state.

Jim
The P.M. stated what I said earlier. The vote was to leave, as everyone knows. That has been repeatedly blocked by Remainers who then cite (without irony) democracy. They are trying to implement what the majority who voted wanted. That's democracy, implementing the will of the people who bothered to vote.
Bull, it wasn't remainers who blocked May's deal.
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Re: Light at the end of Boris' dark tunnel?

Post by Jimgym »

Jimgward wrote: Sun Jul 21, 2019 9:40 pm ... and the vote was always flawed. No referendum for such an important event should ever be a one-off or based on over 50%. We did it wrong and it's torn the country apart.

We saw how Tory voters would rather have Brexit than preserve the UK. Brexit over almost anything else. Even if it means a poorer country, loss of jobs, increased prices. What is that all about?
You say it was wrong because Remain lost. Everyone was very well aware of the conditions of the referendum and I don’t recall anyone saying it was wrong, until the vote didn’t go their way. Anything said afterwards merely comes across as sour grapes and a sense of entitlement that they deserved to win so to speak.
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Re: Light at the end of Boris' dark tunnel?

Post by Jim B »

Jimgym wrote: Sun Jul 21, 2019 6:28 pm
Jim B wrote: Sun Jul 21, 2019 6:06 pm Alan
Cameron was wrong to state that the referendum was anything more than advisory, it's that straight forward.
The High Court have confirmed the referendum was only advisory and that's why they couldn't make a judgement even though they agreed the referendum was flawed.
As I asked you several posts ago; where is the democracy when parties are putting 3 line whips on their MPs telling them which way to vote. The UK system is not very democratic, more a two party state.

Jim
The P.M. stated what I said earlier. The vote was to leave, as everyone knows. That has been repeatedly blocked by Remainers who then cite (without irony) democracy. They are trying to implement what the majority who voted wanted. That's democracy, implementing the will of the people who bothered to vote.
Cameron mislead the people by stating it was legally binding; referendums are only advisory. He's not the first PM to mislead the people and no doubt won't be the last.
The link below explains the status of referendums in British politics.

Jim

https://www.channel4.com/news/factcheck ... g-it-wasnt
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Re: Light at the end of Boris' dark tunnel?

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Well, Boris made claims about what he could do re the EU. The pound to euro, which had recovered by .5%, the. Dropped again as the EU pointed out that Boris was out of order and no deal of his type would be acceptable. Having watched his PM questions, he is deluded re the border issue. He claims there is loads of technology to keep an open border. If that was the case, it would be well publicised. It’s fabrication, as usual.

In pm questions he came across well, as in bluster and pomp, but again didn’t answer questions, only referred them or said something unrelated. His financial promises don’t add up and will plunge the U.K. into recession.
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Re: Light at the end of Boris' dark tunnel?

Post by Lincoln »

Well done BoJo you are doing exactly as you said you would. Huge recruiting programme for the police. Letting people know of other ways to keep an open border and the Pound against the Euro is now much more stable at 1.12
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Re: Light at the end of Boris' dark tunnel?

Post by trevnhil »

1.11352 on Xe currency chart at the moment
Trev..
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