Manchester Arena bombing - The Politics

[WHL]

Site Admin Note:

I have split the Manchester Thread in two. The political debate continues here. The non-political discussion continues on the General Section.

I had to start this thread somewhere so started with this post from WHL:

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Sad day....yet more from the Religion of Peace

[William Morris]

During the second world war Hitler thought that the more bombs that were dropped on the UK the more the British people would want to surender, it didnt work then and it wont work now ,

Is he back then? Hitler?

Cannot wait for the retoric from the Government.

Still nothing will be done.

Apparently this cowardly scumbag was known to the police.

[Jimgward]

Apparently at least 12 dead victims are children and one is 8 years old. Tragic.

Twitter last night was full of the example of speculation people made, everything from a balloon popping to machine gun fire.... our normal police and media can't deliver to counter this spouting...

Neither can twitter prevent the vile posts, such as from the usual excrement, like Katie Hopkins... wh- asked when we were going to use "the final solution"

Some people should never have a mouthpiece and sadly she gets paid by much of our media....

[cyprusgrump]

Apparently at least 12 dead victims are children and one is 8 years old. Tragic.

Twitter last night was full of the example of speculation people made, everything from a balloon popping to machine gun fire.... our normal police and media can't deliver to counter this spouting...

Neither can twitter prevent the vile posts, such as from the usual excrement, like Katie Hopkins... wh- asked when we were going to use "the final solution"

Some people should never have a mouthpiece and sadly she gets paid by much of our media....

And what do you think should happen...?

Politicians will spout their usual guff about 'how we will not give in to terrorism', people will post the normal platitudes about how we 'will come back stronger', many will change their profile picture on FaceBook and sales of teddy bears and candles will boom. Oh, and I expect a 2-minute silence at the cup final...

And that will pretty much be it until the next atrocity...

While people like you blame Katie Hopkins for her 'vile posts' and others post concern about the 'rise of Islamaphobia' without condemning the vile ideology behind attacks like this nothing will happen.

Until we all get angry and stop apologising. Until we recognise that multiculturalism that has been forced on us by politicians isn't working. Until people like you attack the vile creature and his ideology that thought it was a good idea to blow himself up and kill as many 'infidels' as possible nothing will happen.

While our response to this is changing our Facebook profile, holding a vigil, 'being stronger' and having a silence at the cup final nothing will change. And until the likes of Katie Hopkins make us angry enough to demand action and not words from our politicians it will get worse and worse.

[smudger]

Good post Grumps

[Jimgward]

And what do you think should happen...?

Politicians will spout their usual guff about 'how we will not give in to terrorism', people will post the normal platitudes about how we 'will come back stronger', many will change their profile picture on FaceBook and sales of teddy bears and candles will boom. Oh, and I expect a 2-minute silence at the cup final...

And that will pretty much be it until the next atrocity...

While people like you blame Katie Hopkins for her 'vile posts' and others post concern about the 'rise of Islamaphobia' without condemning the vile ideology behind attacks like this nothing will happen.

Until we all get angry and stop apologising. Until we recognise that multiculturalism that has been forced on us by politicians isn't working. Until people like you attack the vile creature and his ideology that thought it was a good idea to blow himself up and kill as many 'infidels' as possible nothing will happen.

While our response to this is changing our Facebook profile, holding a vigil, 'being stronger' and having a silence at the cup final nothing will change. And until the likes of Katie Hopkins make us angry enough to demand action and not words from our politicians it will get worse and worse.

I think it's taken for granted that all of us would c0ndemn first, the ideology and inhuman beasts who commit such atrocities.

People like Hopkins, adds nothing other than bile with "the final solution" which she knew referred to the `holocaust and was controversial, since not all Muslims are terrorists, even though at this point, most terrorists are Muslims.

For you and your acolytes to think she is fine, says it all.....

[cyprusgrump]

Good post Grumps

Thanks!

[Jimgward]

These young guys who are being radicalised believe they are fighting for a cause. The evil bastards who are the ring leaders use comments like this to their benefit. If you think for one minute that somewhere in a radicalised training camp they don't hold up the tweet calling for a "final solution" as some sort of motivation for their recruits then your wrong. Not only that but it's massively disrespectful to a whole host of people who lost their lives in the holocaust.

We need to take these flipping idiots to task. They won't be happy until we are at the point of full scale civil war.

[Jimgward]

ISIL Statement;

“With Allah’s grace and support, a soldier of Khilafah managed to place explosive devices in the midst of the gatherings of the Crusaders in the British city of Manchester, in revenge for Allah’s religion, in an endeavor to terrorize the mushirkin and in response to their transgressions against the lands of the Muslims,” the statement said. “The explosive devices were detonated in the shameless concert arena, resulting in 30 Crusaders being killed and 70 others being wounded. And what comes next will be more severe on the worshipers of the Cross and their allies, by Allah’s permission. And all praises is due to Allah, Lord of the creation.”

Sick and for God's sake, who believes such guff, that an 8-year old girl is a Cruasader? These morons need dealt with and the source of their funds cut off. Unfortunately, that means Saudi, Qatar, Oman, Turkey and other countries who are supporting and funding them. Another one, is Israel, for different reasons....

[smudger]

"I think it's taken for granted that all of us would c0ndemn first, the ideology and inhuman beasts who commit such atrocities."

But you didn't Jim.

Agreed, not all Muslims are terrorists. Problem is, none of us know which ones are or are not. And both are living in the UK society. As they are throughout the rest of the world.

This is basically a problem for the Muslim Community. No one else!

They need to address how they are bringing up their children, how they are teaching them in the home, how they are being taught in school, how and what are they being taught in the Mosque, in the after school sessions, how much discipline and learning they are happy to devolve to the mosque, to the Imams, how they deal with problems inside their own four walls. Sorry, Muslim parents devolve far too much teaching, learning and discipline to anyone but themselves.

[cyprusgrump]

And what do you think should happen...?

Politicians will spout their usual guff about 'how we will not give in to terrorism', people will post the normal platitudes about how we 'will come back stronger', many will change their profile picture on FaceBook and sales of teddy bears and candles will boom. Oh, and I expect a 2-minute silence at the cup final...

And that will pretty much be it until the next atrocity...

While people like you blame Katie Hopkins for her 'vile posts' and others post concern about the 'rise of Islamaphobia' without condemning the vile ideology behind attacks like this nothing will happen.

Until we all get angry and stop apologising. Until we recognise that multiculturalism that has been forced on us by politicians isn't working. Until people like you attack the vile creature and his ideology that thought it was a good idea to blow himself up and kill as many 'infidels' as possible nothing will happen.

While our response to this is changing our Facebook profile, holding a vigil, 'being stronger' and having a silence at the cup final nothing will change. And until the likes of Katie Hopkins make us angry enough to demand action and not words from our politicians it will get worse and worse.

I think it's taken for granted that all of us would c0ndemn first, the ideology and inhuman beasts who commit such atrocities.

People like Hopkins, adds nothing other than bile with "the final solution" which she knew referred to the `holocaust and was controversial, since not all Muslims are terrorists, even though at this point, most terrorists are Muslims.

For you and your acolytes to think she is fine, says it all.....

And yet you still focus your bile on somebody that wrote some words in a newspaper (and me and my acolytes obviously) rather than on the cause of this atrocity, and the previous ones and those that are sure to come after this one...

How bizarre...

Until you and yours get as angry about multiculturalism as you do about a newspaper article by those that you disapprove of in a newspaper that you disapprove of then this will continue.

Until we all with one voice stop whinging about some newspaper article or 'homophobic' post on twitter that 'offends' and instead start getting angry about people and children being murdered on the streets of the UK, and FGM, and Halal, and honour killings, and the events depicted in Three Girls nothing will change...

Forget Hopkins, she really isn't the problem. I have no fears whatsoever that she may try and blow up or rape my granddaughters...

[cyprusgrump]

This is basically a problem for the Muslim Community. No one else!

No, sorry...

It is a problem for those that believe in multiculturalism...

It is a problem for those that believe there should be a 'Muslim Community' and those that believe those that move to the UK should be able to exist separately from the rest of society and have their own rules and law and dress code and method of animal slaughter...

Therein lies the problem.

[panoscouse]

These attacks have about as much to do with the Muslim Community as Catholics had to do with the attacks in the 70's, 80's and 90's at the hands of the IRA.

If you cannot see that then you'll never have a solution to your problem.

[Expresspete]

"The world will not be destroyed by those who do evil, but by those who watch them without doing anything."

Albert Einstein

[cyprusgrump]

These attacks have about as much to do with the Muslim Community as Catholics had to do with the attacks in the 70's, 80's and 90's at the hands of the IRA.

If you cannot see that then you'll never have a solution to your problem.

And the solution to my problem is....?

[cyprusgrump]

These attacks have about as much to do with the Muslim Community as Catholics had to do with the attacks in the 70's, 80's and 90's at the hands of the IRA.

If you cannot see that then you'll never have a solution to your problem.

Sorry but you are absolutely wrong....these evil people are allowed to exist, to plan, to spout their idiology within their communities...be it Islamic or indeed Catholic in Northern Ireland...sometimes because the community are fearful for their own lives, and sometimes because they are unwilling to go against their own, it is a disease ..it is only when the community, as happened In Northern Ireland become sick of the violence that is committed in their name, that they rise up and force change..that refuse to harbour and provide succour to the terrorists, to the evil they spread....of course not all Muslims are terrorists..but the small minority that are cannot be allowed to thrive amongst them..the community needs to look inwards, identify and acknowledge the evil that resides amongst them and provide them no,shelter, no place to hide.

Bravo...

[smudger]

"Sorry but you are absolutely wrong....these evil people are allowed to exist, to plan, to spout their idiology within their communities...be it Islamic or indeed Catholic in Northern Ireland...sometimes because the community are fearful for their own lives, and sometimes because they are unwilling to go against their own, it is a disease ..it is only when the community, as happened In Northern Ireland become sick of the violence that is committed in their name, that they rise up and force change..that refuse to harbour and provide succour to the terrorists, to the evil they spread....of course not all Muslims are terrorists..but the small minority that are cannot be allowed to thrive amongst them..the community needs to look inwards, identify and acknowledge the evil that resides amongst them and provide them no,shelter, no place to hide."

Exactly my point Hudswell. Unless and until the Muslim community recognise their failings within there is no hope of conquering the madness. Practically every Muslim spokesperson on the TV begins with excuses and justifications. Why are they unaware of the lunatics in their midst? Why are they allowing their children to be taught this perpetual prejudice? This is not Islam, it's terrorism. The whole Muslim community needs to wake up and come to terns with its own shortcomings. Fast.

Salman Abedi is Manchester born and bred. From the Telegraph -

"He had become radicalised recently - it is not entirely clear when - and had worshipped at a local mosque that has, in the past, been accused of fund-raising for jihadists."

[WHL]

These attacks have about as much to do with the Muslim Community as Catholics had to do with the attacks in the 70's, 80's and 90's at the hands of the IRA.

If you cannot see that then you'll never have a solution to your problem.

Sorry but you are absolutely wrong....these evil people are allowed to exist, to plan, to spout their idiology within their communities...be it Islamic or indeed Catholic in Northern Ireland...sometimes because the community are fearful for their own lives, and sometimes because they are unwilling to go against their own, it is a disease ..it is only when the community, as happened In Northern Ireland become sick of the violence that is committed in their name, that they rise up and force change..that refuse to harbour and provide succour to the terrorists, to the evil they spread....of course not all Muslims are terrorists..but the small minority that are cannot be allowed to thrive amongst them..the community needs to look inwards, identify and acknowledge the evil that resides amongst them and provide them no,shelter, no place to hide.

Was there not Protestant terrorist in Northern Island?

[WHL]

Could we not make a start by expelling all suspected extremists, we have intelligence on..... if they were U.K. Born lock them up for life, or give them a choice to leave the U.K.

[Jimgym]

Very happy to live in a multi cultural Scotland, not forced upon us, by anyone.

I'm sure many people in Manchester felt the same, until Monday night.....