Will the Brexiters be moving back to the UK?

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Jim B
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Re: Will the Brexiters be moving back to the UK?

Post by Jim B » Sat Feb 09, 2019 11:45 am

Hudswell wrote:
Sat Feb 09, 2019 11:02 am
No Jim, it is not cast in stone, but along with ever greater integration within the EU it is an ambition that has been stated and I have absolutely no doubt that it is an agenda that will be pushed and pushed. And no we didn’t want to be part of the Euro, thankfully, but it is a precondition of any new country that joins the EU.
So again you agree with me, the EU Army is just wishful thinking of a few political leaders wereas it's getting little political support from other member countries.
You are correct about new EU members taking up the Euro but the UK like Denmark and Sweden are existing members so it doesn't affect them so it's really a moot point isn't? Unless once the British people realise what a catastrophe leaving was and demand we rejoin then we will have to be part of the Euro, lose any rebates and have to join the Schengen.

Jim

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Re: Will the Brexiters be moving back to the UK?

Post by WHL » Sat Feb 09, 2019 12:11 pm

Jim B wrote:
Sat Feb 09, 2019 11:45 am
Hudswell wrote:
Sat Feb 09, 2019 11:02 am
No Jim, it is not cast in stone, but along with ever greater integration within the EU it is an ambition that has been stated and I have absolutely no doubt that it is an agenda that will be pushed and pushed. And no we didn’t want to be part of the Euro, thankfully, but it is a precondition of any new country that joins the EU.
So again you agree with me, the EU Army is just wishful thinking of a few political leaders wereas it's getting little political support from other member countries.
You are correct about new EU members taking up the Euro but the UK like Denmark and Sweden are existing members so it doesn't affect them so it's really a moot point isn't? Unless once the British people realise what a catastrophe leaving was and demand we rejoin then we will have to be part of the Euro, lose any rebates and have to join the Schengen.

Jim
I can see sometime in the future, the UK joining up again....maybe a new party made up from across the board voters?

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Re: Will the Brexiters be moving back to the UK?

Post by Jim B » Sat Feb 09, 2019 3:39 pm

So its an aspiration now, not set in stone as previously suggested. Right.

Regarding Cyprus being a contributer to the EU; if you look at the figures as a lump sum then yes they have received more than they've paid in but if you look at it year by year they were a net contributer over a number of years which changed around 2012 to them receiving funding. Not as clear cut as you are trying to make out.

Jim

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Re: Will the Brexiters be moving back to the UK?

Post by Jim B » Sat Feb 09, 2019 7:07 pm

You are; you imply that the UK is being forced to become part of an EU Army that is presently an (according to you now) aspiration. You are also raising the spectre of being forced into changing from Sterling to the Euro which is patentally untrue.
I'm not sure whether you make these statements for affect or because you actually believe what you're writing. Macron and Merkel will be gone in a couple of years anyway and any aspirations they may have will go with them.

Jim

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Re: Will the Brexiters be moving back to the UK?

Post by Jim B » Sun Feb 10, 2019 7:48 am

Hudswell
You did raise the spectre of the Euro and European Army taking our sovereignty away. You make outlandish statements and are now repositioning to say you meant "New Members" when you originally were implying the UK would be forced into joining the EU Army; it's not me who needs to keep up.
Just going around in circles now.

Jim

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Re: Will the Brexiters be moving back to the UK?

Post by Jim B » Sun Feb 10, 2019 1:54 pm

Cutting your nose off to spite your face as I and millions like me see Brexit. And I took it in the context it was written, as usual you are moving your position when it was pointed out that the points you raised don't actually affect Britain.

And as I said a while ago, "it ain't over till the fat lady sings" and there's still a long way to go.

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Re: Will the Brexiters be moving back to the UK?

Post by Happy in Cyprus » Sun Feb 10, 2019 5:37 pm

Personally, I love the Euro. I love the fact that we can go to most EU countries and simply take 'normal' everyday currency with us. No need to go to a cash converter down at the harbour, or to a bank and get a less favourable exchange rate. No need to keep doing mental conversions while abroad to decide if something is good value or not. And then when you return from the UK, chances are you have GBP left over which you don't really want. How much nicer, and more sensible, to have one single currency which works (almost) anywhere in Europe.

And yeah, I appreciate it doesn't have the Queen's head on it, but who cares...it works perfectly well without :lol:

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Re: Will the Brexiters be moving back to the UK?

Post by Jim B » Sun Feb 10, 2019 5:39 pm

I would never have imagined why so many sensible people would happily gamble on the future wellbeing of our country without any concern of the possible disastrous consequences.
We'll see when the fat lady sings.

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Re: Will the Brexiters be moving back to the UK?

Post by Happy in Cyprus » Sun Feb 10, 2019 11:49 pm

In another thread in the TV section I used the expression "shooting yourself in the foot"...and as I did so I nearly made a quip about Brexit.

In this Political section I have many times used the word 'hara-kiri'.

Both terms relate to the shambolic death by a thousand swords going on at the moment.

How major manufacturers, many with critical just-in-time processes, are supposed to make contingency plans in the days remaining escapes me.

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Re: Will the Brexiters be moving back to the UK?

Post by Firefly » Mon Feb 11, 2019 5:45 pm

Lloyd, forward thinking ? A bit late now.
It's not the size of the dog in the fight, it's the size of the fight in the dog.

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Re: Will the Brexiters be moving back to the UK?

Post by living the dream » Tue Feb 12, 2019 4:44 pm

It still never ceases to amaze me that certain people on this forum still hold so much faith in the great EU Project and Britain is Doomed, the game is not yet over and the fat lady still has not sang.

George Soros who certain posters love to quote on this forum as being an international finance expert and used his quotes to support the argument that the UK is crazy to have voted to leave the fantastically stable and secure EU has today been quoted as saying" Europe is sleep walking into oblivion and the people of Europe need to wake up before its to late and that Europe could experience the same fate as the Russian collapse in 1991" I personally like this quote from Mr Soros "The current EU Leadership is reminiscent of the Russian Politburo, when the union collapsed they were still issuing orders as if they were still relevant".

Sorry but France is in turmoil, Germany is still breaking EU Financial Rules with financial academics wanting to set up a government wealth fund to protect their industries again breaking with EU Financial aid rules, Italy is still a simmering pot, Poland & Hungary potentially facing financial penalties over immigration, Spain with mass youth unemployment the list goes on. So please can anyone explain to me how the above presents a positive note as to the EU being this wonderful club to be in and how the UK is committing Hari Kari, shooting itself in the foot, a lemming throwing itself off a cliff and any other term used to describe the vote of the 52% who voted to leave were wrong.

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Re: Will the Brexiters be moving back to the UK?

Post by Firefly » Tue Feb 12, 2019 5:01 pm

Good post.

There will always be those who cannot accept that the UK will survive and indeed prosper after Brexit, as I believe it will, generally remainers who will not accept that they LOST the vote.

The call for another referendum will go on for a while I expect, however, what the remainers have not commented on is that if there were to be another, and the outcome was still leave, would they accept it then, or, God forbid, would they still be harking on about a third ?

Jackie
It's not the size of the dog in the fight, it's the size of the fight in the dog.

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Re: Will the Brexiters be moving back to the UK?

Post by Dominic » Tue Feb 12, 2019 5:58 pm

There should only be a second referendum if the situation has changed. The situation will only change once a deal has been struck, or there is going to be no deal.

If either of those criteria are met, and the vote is still leave, then yes, the UK should leave, as that is what the majority of the people who can actually be arsed to vote want.

If a deal has been struck, I don't necessarily think that Remain would win. The prospect of being outside of the EU but with some of the perks might prove quite attractive to a lot of voters, especially those sick of the whole thing. That could be the compromise position that would heal wounds.

If no-deal, then I think remain would have a better chance.
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Re: Will the Brexiters be moving back to the UK?

Post by Firefly » Tue Feb 12, 2019 6:26 pm

Dominic

I appreciate what you say, but I would point out that we voted out, not out if we got a deal from the EU, that doesn't factor into it.

As you say, we are already becoming sick of the whole thing because politicians have done very little to arrange Brexit until now, and it's all panic. Let's just get out, then we can take a deep breath and start from scratch. The deal the EU propose keep us shackled to them in many ways, that isn't what we Brexiteers voted for.

Jackie
It's not the size of the dog in the fight, it's the size of the fight in the dog.

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Re: Will the Brexiters be moving back to the UK?

Post by Jimgward » Tue Feb 12, 2019 8:26 pm

Jackie - -you speak for 17.4m now? It might not be what you voted for - but I know loads of leavers now wanting to step back and I know very few wanting the nightmare of WTO brexit and the disaster that would entail - like the end of manufacturing cars, the shocking prices rises on food and lack of markets for UK goods, that are suddenly more expensive overnight

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Re: Will the Brexiters be moving back to the UK?

Post by Jim B » Wed Feb 13, 2019 12:02 pm

living the dream wrote:
Tue Feb 12, 2019 4:44 pm
It still never ceases to amaze me that certain people on this forum still hold so much faith in the great EU Project and Britain is Doomed, the game is not yet over and the fat lady still has not sang.

George Soros who certain posters love to quote on this forum as being an international finance expert and used his quotes to support the argument that the UK is crazy to have voted to leave the fantastically stable and secure EU has today been quoted as saying" Europe is sleep walking into oblivion and the people of Europe need to wake up before its to late and that Europe could experience the same fate as the Russian collapse in 1991" I personally like this quote from Mr Soros "The current EU Leadership is reminiscent of the Russian Politburo, when the union collapsed they were still issuing orders as if they were still relevant".

Sorry but France is in turmoil, Germany is still breaking EU Financial Rules with financial academics wanting to set up a government wealth fund to protect their industries again breaking with EU Financial aid rules, Italy is still a simmering pot, Poland & Hungary potentially facing financial penalties over immigration, Spain with mass youth unemployment the list goes on. So please can anyone explain to me how the above presents a positive note as to the EU being this wonderful club to be in and how the UK is committing Hari Kari, shooting itself in the foot, a lemming throwing itself off a cliff and any other term used to describe the vote of the 52% who voted to leave were wrong.
I'm really intrigued how you believe the UK is going to make it on it's own when the service industry which is the UK 's biggest industry is hemeoraging to Dublin, Frankfurt and Amsterdam, we have little heavy engineering industry left and what light engineering we have provides widgets to the auto industry or other assembly lines that are based predominantly in the EU.
And it was 36% of the population, not 52% who voted to leave.
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Re: Will the Brexiters be moving back to the UK?

Post by Firefly » Wed Feb 13, 2019 12:45 pm

JimGW

You know so many, strange, I know non, the only person I have spoken to who has changed their mind voted remain, and after seeing exactly how the EU has treated us, with absolute disdain and contempt, that person now would vote leave.


I am sick of seeing Mrs May grovelling at the door of the EU, in fact it embarrasses me that she does so in my name.

You predict doom and gloom and God knows what else post Brexit (if it ever happens) for the UK, I don't see it that way.

Jackie
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Re: Will the Brexiters be moving back to the UK?

Post by Jimgward » Wed Feb 13, 2019 12:55 pm

Jackie, I really, really, hope you are correct and I am 100% wrong - I really do ....

But if it was all looking rosy, I wonder why businesses are now in panic mode, running Brexit risk assessments and stockpiling food and medicines, never mind moving offices, making contingencies and so on.

Mrs May, could be seen, from the other side, as someone who has waited over 2 years to then go into panic mode with no home agreement on anything she agrees to in the EU. It is like a company sending someone with no authority, to negotiate a transaction - the other side knows that it won't be held to and that they are simply wasting their time.

If the country backed no-deal Brexit, they're not telling their elected officials that - the majority of whom oppose such a thing. It seems we are allowing the country to be dictated to by the ERG, that represents maybe 30 - 40 MPs - rather than the rest.

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Re: Will the Brexiters be moving back to the UK?

Post by WHL » Wed Feb 13, 2019 12:59 pm

A very simple question,
Will the UK, be a more prosperous place/ better standard of living, outside of Europe or within Europe...

Personally I think the UK will be economically worse off.

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Re: Will the Brexiters be moving back to the UK?

Post by Firefly » Wed Feb 13, 2019 2:46 pm

Panic Jim, you are absolutely correct, I agree with you.

Mrs May has left it far too late to act on Brexit, of course everyone is in panic mode, they don't know, and neither do we, where will be in six weeks time. We can all see what apparently politicians could not, too little, too late, this should all have been organised months ago.

Firstly Cameron, who threw his toys out of the pram and legged it, failed us. Now Mrs May, who I think has tried to pick up the pieces, is seen to have failed us, so far. No-one can predict the future, we can all speculate, but in truth, no-one knows. Personally I am concerned that we will never leave as I can see Brexit being postponed ad infinitum, I hope to God not.

Jackie
It's not the size of the dog in the fight, it's the size of the fight in the dog.

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